Hello P.D users.

I’m sure the recent news of lemmy.world’s removal of piracy communities has not escaped the attention of many of you. For those who have not heard, here is their announcement on the matter.

Now, being as transparent as possible, this is not a subject that the admin team of P.D have discussed in great detail up until this point. We have yet to create an explicit rule stating that piracy related content is forbidden on this instance, and doing so is not something any of us wish to do.

With that being said, this topic requires more deliberation and consideration. There is more complexity to this issue than taking a stance for, against, or tolerant of piracy. There are legal considerations. And the truth is that we are not 100% sure on what the legal implications are for allowing piracy related content to exist on this instance, either directly on our communities or indirectly via federation.

One thing that must be considered when looking into the legalities is jurisdiction. I believe being part of a larger federation complicates this more than a centralised service, but P.D must at a minimum be considerate of the laws of the country its server(s) is hosted in, and the laws of the country the person responsible for the instance resides in.

For those who don’t know, this instance is administrated by a reasonably large team of volunteers, but is hosted and ultimately provided by only one: snowe. There is no legal entity behind P.D other than his person, and this means that any ramifications of this subject ultimately fall on his shoulders.

After an initial discussion between us, it is clear that some professional legal advice is required. Snowe is intending to seek formal legal advice. Up until that point, we cannot say what the official P.D stance will be on this topic long term.

What I can say, is that nobody in this administrative team desires to impose any restrictions on users of this instance that overreach and limit discussion unnecessarily. So long as content here is not dangerous, hurtful or offensive, we have no wish to filter it out on an instance level. Communities can impose their own rules, for the most part.

You can expect a further update on this topic in the future, once we have a better understanding ourselves, and we will keep this topic as transparent as we possibly can. Until then, in relation to this matter, we do not currently intend to defederate from any instances or ban any communities that discuss piracy. Linking to websites that provide pirated content will also not be explicitly banned, but linking to or directly hosting pirated content on P.D is prohibited. Should any of these rules change, we will communicate it as quickly as possible and far ahead of any drastic action that would need to take place as a result.

I believe the majority of our users here will understand the pressure that any Lemmy instance faces by hosting content that can make them susceptible to legal action. To those of you who are understanding, we thank you for that, and are grateful for your patience with us while we get a better understanding ourselves.

Feel free to discuss this matter here.

Thanks,
The P.D. Admin Team.

  • onlinepersona@programming.devEnglish
    117·
    8 months ago

    Honestly, it’s a programming focused instance, so I’m not quite sure how piracy even fits into it. Banning it from the instance would be fine by me. Banning servers that talk about piracy though 🤔 My initial thought would be that the piracy community isn’t on this instance, so it’d be a surprise if there’s any legal basis to charge PD with anything related to it. It’s good that legal advice will be sought.

    Regardless, even if it were banned to spare snowe the headache, it’s no biggie. I’d just create a separate account to talk about piracy on the instance that allows piracy-related talk.

    CC BY-NC-SA 4.0

    • bugsmith@programming.devOP
      19·
      8 months ago

      the piracy community isn’t on this instance, so it’d be a surprise if there’s any legal basis to charge PD with anything related to it.

      This is not so clear-cut. The nature of federation means that any posts you see through via this instance are hosted here too. How liable we are for that content is certainly an important question.

      Thanks for your feedback.

      • towerful@programming.dev
        19·
        8 months ago

        I dont imagine many people are here for piracy.
        Other than the creative art of cracking, it seems antitheses to career programmers.
        Anything piracy related that might also be (legitimately) programming related can be reposted.

        The root of the issue is bigger than an one instance.
        It needs political change to make it make sense, until then we are stuck with decades old laws that dont make sense.

        • recursive_recursion [they/them]@programming.devEnglish
          6·
          8 months ago

          Anything piracy related that might also be (legitimately) programming related can be reposted.

          Breaking laws in cases of civil disobedience (fighting authoritarianism and oppression) is a thing however breaking laws because of one’s own beliefs can be seen as foolish and reckless if done so without proper reasoning and planning.

          I don’t imagine many people are here for piracy.
          Other than the creative art of cracking, it seems antitheses to career programmers.

          Piracy cases such as preservation are valid however they make the legality+morallity of this area quite murky. Like Nintendo for example is attrocious when it comes to catering and nuturing their audience so I feel no sympathy when I hear piracy occurring. But at the same time it is very much illegal in most regions.

          The root of this issue is bigger than one instance.
          It needs political change to make it make sense, until then we are stuck with decades old laws that don’t make sense.

          Unfortunately this is true. We still live in a society where major corporations just don’t get why people commit piracy in the first place and most of us live in places with strict piracy laws with very real legal rammifications one which we very much can’t afford now and maybe even never.

          • it sucks but the tradeoffs atm are not reasonable for anyone let alone us to take the risk
            • we’ll have to see what the decision and recommendations are once we’re able to consult and talk with lawyers+legal experts
          • Scoopta@programming.dev
            3·
            8 months ago

            Ngl when Nintendo got yuzu to fold I was like

            Well I’m never giving that company money ever again

            I’m usually mostly against piracy, not for legal reasons but because I think the creators should be rewarded for their hard work making content people enjoy…but Nintendo can go fly a kite…and crash it while they’re at it.

    • elint@programming.dev
      2·
      8 months ago

      Honestly, it’s a programming focused instance, so I’m not quite sure how piracy even fits into it.

      I think you and I have different visions of what the fediverse is. I don’t view this account as a “programming account on a programming forum, so all things should be programming related” if that’s what you are implying. I view instances as a comfortable home for my existence in the fediverse, where local communities may be programming related, but I still have access to the fediverse as a whole.

      Much like I chose the city I live in based on the communities and amenities I prefer most of the time, but I can still travel anywhere else in the world any time I choose.

      I’m against actual pirated content being federated here, but I would still like to see discussion about piracy if it is acceptable within the laws of @snowe’s home country.