It’s just another money/power grab. Tech bros want to spy on your kids to train their mythical AGI God, make shit loads of money and be in a position of influence.
Take away people’s economic independence. Take their intellectual capital. Take their capacity to learn and think independently and ultimately their capacity to play and imagine.
The sheep are being led towards a very fucking grim world.
Lets be clear it isn’t the tech that is bad. Self hosting a model for a task that suits it like speech recognition for a disabled person is righteous and liberating.
I hate to agree with the Marxists of Lemmy but the problem is very much capitalism as it is with global warming, pollution and a social inequality. Where I will split with them historically is I still believe in liberal democracies capacity to regulate capitalism for a common good. But when everyone has outsourced their thinking to a corporate AI from birth to death democracy is fucked isn’t it.
We need to be aware of how we are being fucked over, sceptical of people pushing this shit and engaged politically to make sure it is regulated appropriately otherwise these cashed up AI fuckers are going to write legislation for our politicians to rubber stamp.
it isn’t the tech that is bad. Self hosting a model for a task that suits it like speech recognition for a disabled person is righteous and liberating.
Even that is tricky. One must check how the model itself was trained, namely :
You call out Capitalism correctly for causing these very conditions due to the profit motive, but still cling onto the illusion that capitalism can somehow be “regulated”. The very point of capitalism is to maximize profits while eliminating costs, it takes no account of the conditions or quality of life of workers since that is literally not the goal. Even just from a logisitcal analysis its obvious, since any social reforms cut into profits by their very nature, and will never be taken on by a capitalist org unless forced to. And when Capitalists have much more political power through lobbying groups and legalized bribery, we don’t regulate capitalism, capitalism regulates us.
i don’t know where you are, but it sounds like you are extrapolating. capitalism can work, as long as it is controlled. capitalist system in a socialist state can produce quite good results. neither china nor usa do that in a healthy way.
if you want working examples, i suggest looking into different european countries. obviously no system is perfect - but there are systems which do work.
Capitalism is an economic method based on ensuring shareholder weath above all else. By its nature it demands that rate of profit increase year after year, but rate of profit naturally declines over time, so to ensure line keeps going up, austerity measures are implemented to cut costs such as layoffs and cuts to social support systems (even corporate ones). The point of capitalism is to extract value to the capitalists away from the workers, at as high a rate as possible. And unless you own a factory or some capital others work to earn you profit, you’re a worker not a capitalist.
Capitalism is all about direct profits over long term gains, its goal is not something that “can work as long as it is controlled”. It will always reach a point of cannibalization in the pursuit of ever increasing profits where it creates crisis it can no longer control as conditions have deteriorated so dramatically, at which point it will try and consolidate power to maintain it. Thats why so many European countries are in similar right-wing crises as the U.S. The AfD in germany, brexit and the right wing ship of Brittan, the rise of right wing in Australia, many Latin Ametican country issues such as Lula abanndoning progressive policies, and Modi in India; and these are just some choice examples. And no, I don’t think China’s “red capitalism” is the answer either, but the implication that capitalism can somehow be regulated is a dangerous psudeo-intellectual neoliberalist illusion. It’s like letting a rabid bear in your bed and claiming you’ll be fine as you don’t make eye contact, all while you’re slathered in honey. The goal is for profit maximization, which comes at the cost of quality of life of the people, since that is expensive.
I think a good start to being on the same page would be if you defined what you think Capitalism is as an explicit definition, because I suspect there may be a disconnect there.
what you are describing is mainly driven by the stock market. ‘investors’ want to buy raw materials / shares / options / NFTs / whatever you can buy. preferably one day after that, they want to sell it for 100% profit. this causes things like CEOs, which jump into a company with the single goal of rising share prices for the 1-2 years, before jumping ship. not caring a bit about the longevity of the company.
to say capitalism will regulate itself is about as naive as saying that the comunist dictator will give you the things you need, while never taking more for himself and his friends.
that is why capitalism can work - embedded in a comunist state. no, not whatever china is doing. you need the pink glasses version of capitalism to drive innovation and competition. at the same time the pink glasses version of comunism to ensure social security and the freedom for creativity.
if i want to open a coffee shop in my neighborhood. but there are already two of those in the my small neighbourhood. communism sais the needs are already met, therefore i am not allowed. capitalism sais the market is already saturated, therefore noone gives me a loan. i like the freedom to do my own mistakes, so i choose the capitalist system and open the coffeeshop with my own money. to get people to actually come, i need to setve better coffee, cheaper coffee or offer something the other two don’t.
if i am a software developer and have that idea for an amazing FOSS project. A socialist state covers my base needs and i can work the whole day on the project. hopefully everyone can profit from that work in the future, free of charge.
so yes: business and politics need to be separated, just as church and politics where many years ago. but the idea stands: let capitalism be free. a business without any more growth but consistently paying the salaries of its employees and keeping up with the time is a good thing. but its oversight needs to be a socialist state: social security reliable and generally ensured healthcare. so noone falls between the cracks. go further: conditionless base income, so people can work on their passion. noone should earn more than x times his lowest paid employee (1:12 was a thing a while ago?).
the motivation of having more is still there: i want a good job / profitable business. but if you replace all your employees by AI, that is fine. Because your earnings skyrocketed you pay a good amount more towards welfare. some of the people you let go might even enjoy the time and finally work on their passion project.
It’s just another money/power grab. Tech bros want to spy on your kids to train their mythical AGI God, make shit loads of money and be in a position of influence.
Take away people’s economic independence. Take their intellectual capital. Take their capacity to learn and think independently and ultimately their capacity to play and imagine.
The sheep are being led towards a very fucking grim world.
Lets be clear it isn’t the tech that is bad. Self hosting a model for a task that suits it like speech recognition for a disabled person is righteous and liberating.
I hate to agree with the Marxists of Lemmy but the problem is very much capitalism as it is with global warming, pollution and a social inequality. Where I will split with them historically is I still believe in liberal democracies capacity to regulate capitalism for a common good. But when everyone has outsourced their thinking to a corporate AI from birth to death democracy is fucked isn’t it.
We need to be aware of how we are being fucked over, sceptical of people pushing this shit and engaged politically to make sure it is regulated appropriately otherwise these cashed up AI fuckers are going to write legislation for our politicians to rubber stamp.
Even that is tricky. One must check how the model itself was trained, namely :
rather than just solely have a positive use case and being privacy preserving.
You call out Capitalism correctly for causing these very conditions due to the profit motive, but still cling onto the illusion that capitalism can somehow be “regulated”. The very point of capitalism is to maximize profits while eliminating costs, it takes no account of the conditions or quality of life of workers since that is literally not the goal. Even just from a logisitcal analysis its obvious, since any social reforms cut into profits by their very nature, and will never be taken on by a capitalist org unless forced to. And when Capitalists have much more political power through lobbying groups and legalized bribery, we don’t regulate capitalism, capitalism regulates us.
i don’t know where you are, but it sounds like you are extrapolating. capitalism can work, as long as it is controlled. capitalist system in a socialist state can produce quite good results. neither china nor usa do that in a healthy way.
if you want working examples, i suggest looking into different european countries. obviously no system is perfect - but there are systems which do work.
Capitalism is an economic method based on ensuring shareholder weath above all else. By its nature it demands that rate of profit increase year after year, but rate of profit naturally declines over time, so to ensure line keeps going up, austerity measures are implemented to cut costs such as layoffs and cuts to social support systems (even corporate ones). The point of capitalism is to extract value to the capitalists away from the workers, at as high a rate as possible. And unless you own a factory or some capital others work to earn you profit, you’re a worker not a capitalist.
Capitalism is all about direct profits over long term gains, its goal is not something that “can work as long as it is controlled”. It will always reach a point of cannibalization in the pursuit of ever increasing profits where it creates crisis it can no longer control as conditions have deteriorated so dramatically, at which point it will try and consolidate power to maintain it. Thats why so many European countries are in similar right-wing crises as the U.S. The AfD in germany, brexit and the right wing ship of Brittan, the rise of right wing in Australia, many Latin Ametican country issues such as Lula abanndoning progressive policies, and Modi in India; and these are just some choice examples. And no, I don’t think China’s “red capitalism” is the answer either, but the implication that capitalism can somehow be regulated is a dangerous psudeo-intellectual neoliberalist illusion. It’s like letting a rabid bear in your bed and claiming you’ll be fine as you don’t make eye contact, all while you’re slathered in honey. The goal is for profit maximization, which comes at the cost of quality of life of the people, since that is expensive.
I think a good start to being on the same page would be if you defined what you think Capitalism is as an explicit definition, because I suspect there may be a disconnect there.
what you are describing is mainly driven by the stock market. ‘investors’ want to buy raw materials / shares / options / NFTs / whatever you can buy. preferably one day after that, they want to sell it for 100% profit. this causes things like CEOs, which jump into a company with the single goal of rising share prices for the 1-2 years, before jumping ship. not caring a bit about the longevity of the company.
to say capitalism will regulate itself is about as naive as saying that the comunist dictator will give you the things you need, while never taking more for himself and his friends.
that is why capitalism can work - embedded in a comunist state. no, not whatever china is doing. you need the pink glasses version of capitalism to drive innovation and competition. at the same time the pink glasses version of comunism to ensure social security and the freedom for creativity.
if i want to open a coffee shop in my neighborhood. but there are already two of those in the my small neighbourhood. communism sais the needs are already met, therefore i am not allowed. capitalism sais the market is already saturated, therefore noone gives me a loan. i like the freedom to do my own mistakes, so i choose the capitalist system and open the coffeeshop with my own money. to get people to actually come, i need to setve better coffee, cheaper coffee or offer something the other two don’t.
if i am a software developer and have that idea for an amazing FOSS project. A socialist state covers my base needs and i can work the whole day on the project. hopefully everyone can profit from that work in the future, free of charge.
so yes: business and politics need to be separated, just as church and politics where many years ago. but the idea stands: let capitalism be free. a business without any more growth but consistently paying the salaries of its employees and keeping up with the time is a good thing. but its oversight needs to be a socialist state: social security reliable and generally ensured healthcare. so noone falls between the cracks. go further: conditionless base income, so people can work on their passion. noone should earn more than x times his lowest paid employee (1:12 was a thing a while ago?).
the motivation of having more is still there: i want a good job / profitable business. but if you replace all your employees by AI, that is fine. Because your earnings skyrocketed you pay a good amount more towards welfare. some of the people you let go might even enjoy the time and finally work on their passion project.