bOtH sIdEs aRe tHe sAaAaAaAamE!!
…yeah I fell into that mental trap for a while too. And yeah, the two party system and FPTP leaves a lot to be desired.
But we gotta focus on the here and how, which is a party of obstructionists at best, and literal Nazis at worst; vs a party of science and rights at best, and kinda toothless / often uninspiring at worst. Voting for anything else, or choosing not to vote at all, is still accepting that one of the aforementioned two will win; you’re just silencing your own voice and letting your countrymen decide on your behalf.
…and when enough people do the same, that’s a great way to end up with fucking Nazis.
A very roundabout way to say “both sides”
A very direct way of shutting any legitimate criticism.
If you can’t acknowledge the flaws in the system, for fear of something worse happening, you’ve already failed. Cause those flaws are going to come back to bite you in the ass anyways.
Until we truly don’t have a two party system, I’m tired of hearing this “both sides” bull. I’m going to choose the party that treats climate change as a real thing, and while progress is not as fast as I would like, they can be convinced to try harder while the other party doesn’t even think it’s real.
I think this is pretty easy to say for people who don’t need incrementalism. Like if your immediate goal is luxury space communism then of course the system itself is in your way, and everyone voting for anything not like luxury space communism is hindering you.
Those of us whose existences remain political, and who have a vocal and highly-organized set of political enemies, can’t afford to vote the whole system into nonexistence. Because who knows where our rights and liberties will be afterwards? Or even if we fail with our moonshot and wind up with fascists – that’s equally as bad for us. Whereas the radical utopians seem to be more “meh, we’ll just try again later. With less LGBTQ+ people I guess!”
Anyway, less evil is actually really important for a lot of people.
I think the good news is that we are taking the proper increments in the US.
- Unions, which democratize workplaces and actually ease the burdens on the working class
- Ranked Choice Voting, which has reached a few states, although it will take some time on a Federal level.
Beyond ranked choice, we really need proportional representation like so many of the more successful parliamentary governments
Yes, we need so many more reps. On every level it’s kinda ridiculous, but I’m unaware of discussions about how to do it.
And we are slowly but surely moving the needle on LGBTQ+ rights and women’s rights. I agree we’re making progress. I disagree that it’s because the parties are both the same actually.
The biggest problem with the two party system is that there is only solution A or solution B. And very often, solution B is only NOT solution A.
In reality there are countless solutions and most of them are NEVER considered.
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Ok but one is “that buzzing sound is annoying” and the other is “help someone cut my arms and legs off”. Different orders of magnitude of evil
Except they’re both parties serving the rich first and foremost. The magnitude of difference is not that large. It’s more like “you better believe I’m eating the turd with a kernel of corn in it because that’s better than the turd without it”
And they both benefit from the other’s existence. It’s good cop, bad cop
Exactly and the thing about good cop, bad cop is that both cops are working against you.
How do you think LGBTQ people feel about the differences between the parties?
They’re used as a political tool by both parties to hold back progress. The idea is to laser focus on one important issue (that the rich really don’t care which direction it goes in) so that all the other important issues get ignored.
Except one party actually gives us rights and liberties, and the other seeks to take them away. In fact, gays and lesbians can now marry; trans identity is illegal to discriminate against in the workpace. And Republicans are working tirelessly to undermine that. That hardly seems like an unimportant issue, does it?
I said it was an important issue but one that the rich don’t care which direction it takes, so democrats and republicans can play tug of war with it until the end of time while ignoring other issues. Did you read my post? Not sure where you got “unimportant” from.
Yes, your rights are a football in a class war. It’s bullshit. It keeps us voting “blue no matter who”
What class war? The rich and poor are perfectly aligned in not wanting to give me rights.
I wanna know how many of the “both sides suck” people vote for other parties. There are other parties. But usually when I point this out, the response is “but they have no chance of winning!”
Maybe they would… If you voted for them instead of only looking at the big 2.
I mean, your not wrong on paper but in reality the way or voting system/ electoral college works makes it so a third party winning pres is functionally impossible. Until we do something with the electoral college and switch to something like ranked choice, a third party vote is a ballot in the trash.
While I totally get that, I do also feel if there ever was a time where the majority of voters didn’t pick democrat or republican, shit would change pretty fucking quickly when it didn’t change the outcome and people get, understandably, pissed. Playing into the system doesn’t change it. Bending it and breaking it does.
The majority don’t want to have to put in the energy to choose between more than the “good guys” and the “bad guys”, though. So wishing for a change accomplishes nothing.
I usually find they don’t vote at all or make like libertarians and succumb to the right on polling day.
