• tal@lemmy.today
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    10 months ago

    So what’s the best solution? You might think switching to an electric vehicle is the natural step. In fact, for short trips, an electric bike or moped might be better for you—and for the planet.

    However, in an enclosed EV, you aren’t out in the weather.

    I’ve spent time bike-commuting, and I live somewhere where the weather is pretty mild. But there’s a pretty big difference between being out in the wet and wind and cold when it’s raining or whatnot and being inside a dry, air-conditioned or heated cabin.

    But it’s more than that—they are actually displacing four times as much demand for oil as all the world’s electric cars at present, due to their staggering uptake in China and other nations where mopeds are a common form of transport.

    I mean, that’s fine, but as the article points out, that’s because China’s consumers are generally more price-sensitive and the likely alternative is a moped. If you’re gonna get a gasoline-powered moped or an electric bicycle, sure, unless the range is an issue, the e-bike is a pretty reasonable drop-in replacement.

    But people in the US don’t generally commute via gasoline-powered moped. That is, they’ve already made a judgement as to the tradeoffs, and I strongly doubt that whether-or-not the vehicle has an electric or gasoline motor is going to change this.

    https://www.census.gov/content/dam/Census/library/publications/2021/acs/acs-48.pdf

    I don’t know which category a moped fits into here, but looking at Table 1 on Page 2, I assume that it’d be one of the following groups:

    • 0.1% of Americans commute via motorcycle.

    • 0.5% of Americans commute via bicycle.

    • 1.0% of Americans use “other means”.

    Compare to:

    • 84.8% use a car, truck, or van

    • 5.0% use public transportation

    I don’t think that introducing electric motors into the mix is going to be the factor that drastically changes the above ratios.

    • tal@lemmy.today
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      10 months ago

      That being said, it is true that there are vehicles in-between a car and a moped, including things that have enclosed cabins. But…they haven’t really taken off as a class in the US, be it for safety or other reasons.

      The EU has a “quadricycle” class of vehicles:

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quadricycle_(EU_vehicle_classification)

      The US equivalent is a “low speed vehicle”.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Low-speed_vehicle

      I remember watching a Fifth Gear episode where they almost rolled an instance of these, a Citroen Ami, over in a tight turn – they apparently don’t need to conform to the same safety requirements that automobiles do. I’ll believe that there is a legitimate niche – like, in a city with a serious lack of parking, one might be able to squeeze into tight parking spots that a full-size car couldn’t. And if you’re really, really tight on funds, then one might make sense.

      https://electrek.co/2023/05/31/are-electric-micro-cars-nevs-and-lsvs-street-legal-in-the-us/

      That’s one of the reasons that LSVs are limited to just 25 mph (40 km/h) top speed and can only be operated on roads with speed limits of 35 mph (56 km/h). Both of these are part of the federally mandated LSV regulations and are designed to prevent these vehicles from mixing with larger full-size vehicles at higher speeds, where the result of crashes are more likely to be fatal.

      But you give up the ability to travel on anything other than low-speed roads, you lose crash safety, you lose space, you lose range, a number of amenities have likely been shaved off, and that’s a lot to trade for easier parking and a lower price. I think that that makes something like a quadricycle a difficult sell to most here in competition with a used regular car. Maybe for special cases, like where you’re going to to operate them off public roads – I mean, the golf cart is successful on golf courses. And ATVs are a thing as an off-road utility vehicle on things like farms and on large lots. But I’m skeptical that electric motors are going to make LSVs a major portion of road traffic.

      • Sonori@beehaw.org
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        10 months ago

        I’d suggest that e-bikes have at least some advantage over traditional motorcycles in that you can take them onto public transport such as metro or rail. Or one might find easier parking for them at an enclosed stand af a nearby but out of walking range train station that helps you shave a bus and transfer off your commute in nice weather. The electric motor is definitely an advantage over unpowered bikes in convenience, and a major factor if one can’t or won’t shower when they get to work.

        That being said i’d be amazed if it shifts the needle more than a percent or two at most. Proper show up and go metros take cars off the road by being so obviously better than having to find parking, but e-bikes don’t have the same end user benefits.

        This is all to say nothing of rural areas, which often don’t have the density to support frequent transit becuse “why are we running empty buses, they aren’t turning a profit and that’s all that matters”, but amusingly most of farm country, at least in the US, was actually built around the idea that you would bike in to town if it didn’t require the cart. I mean it make that sane you would need to drop the 50mph limits on country roads down to 35 or so, and the sun will grow cold before any town politician survives trying that, but it was possible.